Luminar AI vs Neo key differences?

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    Lloyd O'Daniel

    Bingo, Matt!

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    Sascha C.

    The model would be ok if you would start to deliver working software and not alphas and betas. It would be ok if you would concentrate on fixing major issues first before you plan, dev and announce a new version

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    Andreas Epmeier

    @Markus Zell: Sorry ich Wechsel mal kurz auf Deutsch und reiche ggf den englischen Text nach. Aber das muss ich schnell los werden.
    Bei Luminar inside fragte jemand, was denn für ein business model ist und ob es nicht besser wäre, wenn man bestimmte Funktion usw optional hinzunehmen könnte(grob zusammengefasst).

    Die offizielle Antwort hat mich sprachlos gemacht. 
    "This is exactly what we aim for..." war die Aussage

    Das würde bedeuten, das wir irgendwann eine "Basisversion" kaufen und sämtliche erweiterten Funktionen oder neue Funktionen nachträglich kaufen müssten. Denn genau das impliziert die Aussage von Skylum.
    Ich habe diese These mal als Frage gestellt und warte noch auf eine Antwort.
    Aktuell widerspricht sich Skylum bei Aussagen etwas oder lässt Fragen unter den Tisch fallen.


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    Bill Youstra

    Context: I bought Luminar AI before it shipped. And I've already purchased Luminar Neo. 

    But Luminar: you need to know that this borders on sleazy/exploitive. AI was janky for the first few months, then tightened up, and 10 minutes later you announce Neo. If you do this again in 2022, your company won't recover. It won't just be a mistake of marketing execution, it will be a demonstrated pattern of an indifferent commitment in your customers. I know it's not your intent, but it's interpreted by your customers as contempt.

    Making matters worse, your responses come across as defensive, evasive responses and just a bit too clever. They betray that you know you're crossing a line. I imagine you had a lot of internal debates on this course of action. You should always bias toward existing customers...they're a huge asset for most companies.

    It would be MUCH BETTER if you just charged more for your products than this short-life nickel & diming. It is a terrible marketing strategy (and remember: I'm actually buying Neo). 

    One last observation: when I bought AI, I was responding to a "great" pre-release deal. I took a chance on you guys. I now see anyone can buy it for 50% cheaper.

    MY RECOMMENDATION TO SKYLUM RE MARKETING STRATEGY:

    • SOMEBODY at Skylum should be responsible for your brand integrity, customer advocacy and marketing strategy. It SHOULDN'T be a software engineer. 
    • EXTEND development & enhancement of AI (and all products) for a full 24 months after initial release. (Look at Affinity for their policies, growth, success, and supportive customers who are a huge source of new customers.)
    • Allow all recent AI purchasers (not me...say the last 3 months) to get Neo for free. They appropriately presumed that AI (being a young product) would incorporate related photo tech innovations for at least the first 12 months of product life.
    • Make your pre-release prices the lowest for the life of the product. Never give people a reason to regret an early/supportive purchase.
    • Review your pricing. It's likely too low. I'm getting Neo for $39 (repeat customer), which is a deal - unless you're going to very quickly EOL it, as I now suspect you will (like it seems w/ AI). You don't have to be in that sleazy business. It raises your unit marketing costs and customer attrition way beyond what's necessary. If you go that route, it's a treadmill of annual releases of thin product with marginal innovations. It's good cashflow initially, but it will decay over time. No one built a big software business following your strategy.
    • Be forthright with your customers. It's not too late. If you didn't intend to create this response, apologize and adapt. People are very forgiving. Your Q3 & Q4 revenue may take a dip (likely not), but your 2022->2025 financials will be much better.

    Good luck! I'm a fan but I can spot good innovation engineering and bad marketing from a mile away. You seem to have both.

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    Markus Zell

    Hi Anastasiia,

    I'm sorry to say that once again we do not get the truth from you: my purchase date of Luminar AI was 8th of July, which is definitely inside the period you mentioned (a couple of months). So far I did not get a free Luminar Neo copy (or a  notification that I would get one). Instead I was asked to pay 49 € for that.

    Maybe you should clarify internally what you're going to do before announcing those steps to your customer base.

    Markus.

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    Sascha C.

    It was also not clear to me and I just preordered Neo, because the risk is minimal. But now you say a couple of month which was not communicated before. I bought on the 3rd July this year. So if this is in the Periode of „couple of month“ I need to know so I request a refund for Neo preorder.

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    Tobias

    Hello Anastasiia

    What does that mean exactly for me who bought Luminar AI end of Juli. Will an automatic download or product will appear in my usercenter or do I have to to something active to get Neo

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    Tobias

    OK. As mentioned by other members of the forum the date was not transparent. 

    You are right, if forwarded the purchase mail the 27.07 to my primary mail account. The purchase itself was 25.07. This is still within the last week of Juli. Too bad if you are not that cullant to accept this late July date as well for a fresh purchased product.

    Perhaps you can ask you colleagues at the support again. 

    Thank you very much

    Tobias 

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    Tobias

    This is what I did because of the statement "Late Juli" and now I know, that I ordered AI two days too early and the support has no cullance window. 

    Thanks Mike, Markus, Sascha for your support.

    Hope Skylum think about your comments and will change something in my account, but otherwise AI is the last version I used from Skylum :-)

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    Londinense

    Ian,

    When I decided to move away from the Lightroom subscription model two years ago I bought both Luminar 4 and On1 PhotoRaw 2020. After playing with both, I decided to use PR as my main photo editor, because it has an LR migration tool and much better DAM. I'm very glad I made that decision and I have only used Luminar for the occasional sky replacement. Now that PR 2022 will have sky replacement, I will have no further use of L4. However I did decide to purchase Neo, as it was only $34 and I will be able to use it as a plug-in in PR 2022. If the dust removal and cable removal features work as promised it will have been money well spent.

    My upgrade to PR 2022 this year cost me $59.99, including a coupon, so I think that was money well spent as well. It is due to be released at the end of this month and, unlike, Luminar products, catalogues carry over to each update.

    When I was doing my research. I did look at several other LR alternatives (eg Affinity), and you might want to do the same and make up your own mind. I should add that I also have Topaz DeNoise AI and Topaz Sharpen AI, since PR 2020 was not adequate in that respect. The new PR will have a much better denoise function called NoNoise AI, so that has hopefully resolved that issue.

    I'm sure I will still need Sharpen AI as it does a brilliant job with images that have motion blur.

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    Markus Zell

    Danke, Andreas. Eine weitere verwirrende und widersprüchlliche Aussage mehr oder weniger verwundert mich ehrlich gesagt nicht mehr. Solange da keine Klarheit mehr herrscht, die dann auch vertrauenswürdig ist, bin ich raus.

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    Member

    Im really suprised how this software is s***. I can't save changes back to LR. Lumiar AI is crashing all the time, I thought it's really good, but I think I will refund it soon.It's not working,

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    Lloyd O'Daniel

    Context: I bought Luminar AI before it shipped. And I've already purchased Luminar Neo. But Luminar: you need to know that this borders on sleazy/exploitive.

    Which will continue or get worse until people like you stop being enablers. No offense....just sayin'.

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    Sascha C.

    the grace Periode is whatever it takes not to be customer oriented. I guess it is from 31th July 3:00:00 AM to 31th Jluy 3:00:01 AM in their TimeZone

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    Don Keninitz

    Face it: Skylum is a company of hucksters with a long history of delivering half-finished software and then abandoning it while promising new wunderkind software under a different name six months later.  I made my last Skylum purchase when I was duped into purchasing AI, a disappointing program to put it mildly.  Neo will be late, half-finished, and have a shelf life of no more than six months before they start promising something else, claiming it's not a replacement when in fact it is.  I've never seen a worse bunch of shysters.

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    Black Eyes

    Hi Anastasia,

    Thanks for your kind words. Unfortunately, after one year of poor performance, I do not believe Support Team anymore.

    - I don't think it depends mainly on computer configurations, when software has poor performance. My computer fully corresponds to requirements: iMac, i7, 3GHZ, 32 GHz RAM, approx. 5000 pictures on internal 2Tb Fusion Drive.

    - I have contacted your support already several times. Mostly the typical answers were: "please, try this, then try that", then they proposed "workarounds". Finally as they cannot really help, they proposed some stuffs for free.

    I can understand, just after release it may have some bugs, but Support team said that it's your first priority to fix these issues, but after one year, the main problems are still there ... Then you announce and spam us with the announcement of NEO.

    Please, don't consider customers as stupide!

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    Don Keninitz

    @ Black Eyes - Yes, you exposed one of the common nonsensical go-to excuses used by Skylum for it's buggy software.  I run an iMac Pro w/ a Core i7 8-core Xenon processor, 32GB of RAM, and a 1TB internal drive.  I can run Logic Pro w/ virtually no latency; Final Cut runs flawlessly.  To this day Luminar 4 runs slowly.  AI was such lousy and unintuitive software that I essentially abandoned it and went back to Lightroom, so I can't speak to its performance.

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    Markus Zell

    PC Configuration is one thing (I'm using a High-End PC here with AMD Ryzen 9 5900HX plus nVidia RTX 3080 Laptop GPU), nevertheless the performance is - let's say - kind of slow.

    The more important thing is that instead of adressing the performance and stability issues a new software is announced and - as I read in this forum - is scheduled for next year, although the money is already accepted this year.

    As written in another thread this is not my understanding of "customer focussed product development". I see a huge focus on "making money" which is ok if comes with great products - which is not the case here.

    For that reason I dropped the Skylum product line and am building a workflow with products from supplier which are more customer oriented.

    Maybe I have a limited view on customer service as I'm working in that business for a US based company, but this makes me believe that there is something fishy with this company and their products.

    Good bye, Skylum.

    Markus.

    P. S. No, please don't write something like "I'm so sorry that you experience a bad behavior or our products" - I'm not sending anything to support@wedontcare.com...

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    Alan Hubberman

    Ivan,

       I'm sorry but bunk.  I have been duped by Skylum as a replacement for the subscription model. You can say what you want, but I'll take Adobes model over this throw more apps at the wall model any day.  Create a good editing app and update it to include new features and quit hiding behind the we updated current software and create new software to give options ...I am moving on. I am a software engineer...if I worked this way I'd be fired.

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    Londinense

    The only practical way to use Luminar is as a plug-in. Then one isn't stuck with its useless catalogues. I'm glad to say that On1 PhotoRaw 2022 will support Photoshop plug-ins, so I am hoping that my purchase of Neo won't be a waste of $34.

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    Member

    Ok this is troubling and really annoying. So I just recently ordered AI in September. Because a friend recommended it to me. So far I've enjoyed using it...... and suddenly there's a new Neo coming out. I thought it was an update so I said ok cool but now i'm being told its a second app stand alone and has its own templates. So am I to rebuy templates all over again for a new app ?

    And why am I charged for 1 seat for Neo if I just bought AI ? I got no notification that I could download a complimentary Neo copy because I just ordered AI ?  This is nuts.  

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    Deepak Gupta

    Hey guys, I went to Luminar website and was offered a combo of AI and Neo. I came here looking for answer to whether I need both AI and Neo or just Neo.

    Having read several comments here, it does seem the organization doesn't treat customers well and replaces old products instead of giving at least a year worth of upgrades. Thank you so much. I would not be purchasing it for myself. 

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    Önder Kacak

    I was about to place an order for Luminar Neo because of the Black Friday offer for 44€ on Sunday, November 28th but I decided no to because of Skylum's upgrade policy, the continued problems I am reading about customers are having regarding the customer dissatisfaction Skylum is working hard on every day.

    I read in another post in the Skylum forum a customer has received a notification by Skylum that Luminar Neo will be delayed to February 2022. When it's due in February or maybe even later I am sure Skylum will come up with Luminar AI 2.0 or Luminar Neo Pro in Summer 2022 advertising it as "with a completely new engineered core that works more stable and even faster than any other previous version" for pre-orders for its release in later 2022. That marketing policy smells pretty fishy to me.

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    Black Eyes

    Hi All,

    I have only Luminar AI but I think that I will never by anything at Skylum because their poor product quality and especially their "EMPTY" promises.

    Luminar AI has very poor performance (extremely slow), uses high resources (high RAM use) and not reliable (broken link, lost edits).

    Skylum pretended that it's their first priority to fix these issues several months. I didn't notice real improvements. Do you notice the improvements?

    Skylum now launching NEO instead of fixing first Luminar AI issues. As customer, I feel cheated. As its softwares, Skylum is not reliable company, therefore I will not spend any cents for such company.

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    Matt Orth

    “Usually, the performance depends on the number of photos you have in your catalog, their format, your hardware configuration, etc. “

    Blame the customer…

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    Ferenc Fapal

    Hi,

    I feel you all, guys. I've paid for Luminar 4, was wise enough to skip AI, and then I was lured in to pay for Neo. Now, as Neo was postponed until February (that actually may be a good sign, given they would finally release something stable for version 1.0), I am considering a refund if it won't live up to the expectations set by the very efficient marketing engine.

    Also, yesterday I've found this deal on Humble Bumble:
    https://www.humblebundle.com/software/photo-editing-to-max-with-luminar-ai-software?partner=eb

    I don't know that it means that all the apps and styles in this offer will be abandoned (as they already did with Luminar 4), that is why the very low price?

    How is Luminar AI now? Is it fast, is it stable? Maybe I will just go for this deal and will buy Neo in a similar bundle in 2 years... ;)

    Skylum, you really need to respect your existing customers much better as the trust of community would yield much more revenue than this sort term advantages. Also, it is okay to sell your products for more, but stick with one product and keep developing that, not abandoning every year. People are also sick and tired to learn new things all the time.

    Good luck,
    Ferenc

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    Member

    I’ve got the trial version of Luminar AI installed as a LrC plugin, and trying to decide whether to buy it now.  Is there anything AI can do that Neo cannot?  If not, I consider Neo an upgrade, even though it doesn’t seem to be marketed that way.

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    Ferenc Fapal

    Member, according to Skylum website AI and Neo are 2 different products, that is why I decided in the end to buy the bundle I linked above.

    Though Luminar AI still eats A LOT of resources, on M1 Pro machines it is quite responsive and it can achieve amazing effects fast. So there is no doubt that there is a lot of know-how in Skylum, they just should change their product and pricing policy and do like other normal companies do (Capture One for example), so release a yearly product with an option to upgrade to it, but keep the base product as it is and do gradual improvements to it each year. If one needs a feature developed during the last one year, then he pays and upgrade fee. If he is content with the last years version, he just keeps using that.

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    Member

    Thanks, Ferenc. I’m new to Skylum and, while impressed with their technology, I find their product lineup and pricing a bit confusing. I appreciate your answer.

    Even on my M1 Air, I find AI to be extremely fast. I’m confident Neo will run quickly enough.  When purchased as part of the bundle, AI is only $29, which is a bargain in my book.  I suppose I’ll spring for it. 

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    Matt Orth

    Aurora HDR is only supported if your camera is two years old or older. There is no ETA on updates to support newer cameras

    Skylum reps tend to leave out important details like that.

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