Luminar 3.0.1: too easy to loose edits
Hi,
It's much too easy to loose edits in Luminar 3:
1. Edit a picture in Luminar
2. From outside Luminar, move the picture to a directory not in the Luminar catalog. Luminar detects the move and removes the file from its catalog.
3. Move the picture back into its previous location (same filename, same directory, no changes to the original file). Luminar shows the file in its interface, but with no edits.
Here's another way to loose edits:
1. Edit a picture in Luminar
2. Use an external tool, such as exiftool, to modify the picture's metadata. For instance, given Luminar has no support yet for keywords and geotagging, I use other geotagging tools, generate an XMP file, and then use exiftool to "burn" the data into my raw CR2 file.
3. As soon as the file is changed externally as described, Luminar seems the consider it's a new file, and all edits are gone!
I've done those tests with RAW files, and that's already scary enough for me to write this post. I wonder if I would also loose Luminar edits on a JPG file that I would then edit further outside of Luminar? Anyone wants to try and post the results?
This is, in my opinion, a major limitation, as I can't trust Luminar not loosing my edits. So although Luminar claims that it works with pictures in the file system and does not move them to a proprietary, opaque catalog, the situation is worse, as it misleads the user into thinking he is more free to do as he will with his picture files, but it's not true. It seems that once a file is in the Luminar catalog, it's best to do all file manipulations within Luminar. Given Luminar doesn't yet support editing metadata, doesn't seem to have geotagging on the roadmap, has no way to rename files in batch within the interface, this makes for a very tedious workflow. One then has to do all metadata manipulations BEFORE importing the files in the Luminar catalog, and then refrain from making further changes outside of Luminar, or be really really careful about it, on the fear of losing Luminar edits.
Given this, I think bringing back a way to save edits next to the original file should be first on the feature priority list. Until this is implemented, I can't trust Luminar 3 to not lose my work. For instance, when Luminar adds metadata support, if it's still stored in the catalog, I won't be able to trust it not losing my metadata changes, just like for the edits!
Please, bring back a way to have the edits and metadata in a file next to the original, ideally the standard XMP file, to avoid littering the folders with extra proprietary data files.
Until then, sadly, I think I'm going to stick to Luminar 2018 for my edits.
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@Collene: You understood correctly. Right now, as of version 3.0.2, L3 does not support saving to .lmnr files. All edit history and all star ratings are stored in its private folder structure named "Luminar Catalog" that is separate from the actual pictures folder. So there's no way to "not use the catalog" in L3, even if you don't care about the Library feature, that is, the ability to browse and organize pictures in Luminar.
I already have 3.0.2 as I'm from Canada. I'm eager to get the "worldwide" 3.0.2 release next week, as the one I got had one new major issue regarding the way it scans folders that I immediately reported, and they confirmed they will fix it in time for the worldwide release. Aside from that 3.0.2 is working better than 3.0.1 for me, so it's a step in the right direction!
Another good news: Luminar support confirmed to me that they plan to fix the problem of loosing edits described in this thread, in version 3.1.0. They didn't say how they intend to solve this. No word of supporting saving the edits to .lmnr files. We'll have to wait and see how that turns out.
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@Yves
Jan 17, when I asked about saving project files in L3, I got this response: "We’ll add the ability to save project files later but at the moment I don’t have a timeline for that.", along with the suggestion that I could preserve the settings used in a project by saving those settings into a Look.
I was underwhelmed by this advice as that is a totally different thing than saving the history of the edits you have done on a photo, but I suppose it is technically a workaround solution.
Thanks for the very detailed description of the issues you have found; it is quite helpful in understanding the capabilities and limitations!
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Question to Yves (i guess)
When you use the quick-edit function (so not the library) are the edits including the history not saved as well ?
i statetd installing LR3 without catalog to see what bugs I ran into without the library functinponality, but didn’t test this one yet, perhaps later this afternoon..
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@Collene: Thanks for the tips!
@Ben: The edit history for quick edited files is also saved in the "Luminar Catalog" folder. If you move the quick edited files to another path while Luminar is closed, Luminar looses track of it and shows a "warning triangle" over the picture. The preview is still there and the edits are there too, but they're all greyed out. You have to move the file back to its original location to be able to continue editing it. Luminar doesn't show where that original location was, so you better remember!
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Thanks for the info Yves,
I was afraid of that.
Did some further testing and ha, it gets even better ?? It's a bit different in my case
1. I work without the library activated (did that with the installation of LR3)
2. I perform a quick edit on a RAW file, nice with history, and shows me the RAW-file extension and some other info
3. I quit LR3 and open it again -> all fine still see the Right RAW info and the edits, including history.
4. Quit LR3 and afterwards move the picture to another folder.
5. Re-open LR3. It still shows the picture with the original RAW-info, however indeed no history, but also no possibility to make any edit at all, also no "Looks" available. In Edit mode it says jpeg, but the info pain shows me the original Exif data (RAW, camera model etc)..No warning triangle mark or what so ever to tell me that the original isn't available or lost.
6. Quit LR3 again and moved the picture back to it's original location. And yes all is back.
Miraculous -;)
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@Ben. What you’re seeing while Luminar lost track of the RAW file is a jpeg preview that Luminar generated when you last edited the file. It’s uneditable. I also got that behaviour. That’s what I meant when I said the edits were greyed out. Weird that you didn’t get the triangle warning though.
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@Yves,
That makes sense, as under the “edit tab” it says jpeg and not RAW. The info still shows teh RAW info.
In the “pastl when I had the library active, i got indeed the triangle mark.
Having installed luminar for a second time without library and only using quick-edits it apparently doesn't.
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@K.G. Wuensch
From a data migration standpoint, version 3.0.2 seems to have resolved the UUID issue with the "Locate Missing Folder" option. I didn't think that it would be that simple to fix edits being tied to the hardware but it does work indeed. I just performed a data migration from one external drive to another and all edits were retained. Steps I took:
- Moved the catalog via Preferences from the internal drive ("Macintosh HD") to the external drive ("Data"). At first this didn't seem to do anything when I changed the location but after about a 30sec delay, the app started doing something and refreshed the folder structure. It basically had to copy over the data first but there was no indication that it was doing so.
- Closed Luminar. Since it watches the filesystem, it probably would be devastating to be open during this process.
- Copied all data (including catalog) from "Data" to a new external drive "Data2".
- Renamed "Data" to "DataOld" and then unmounted the drive.
- Renamed "Data2" to "Data" to keep the same name in order to make inheriting backup easier. I don't think it would matter for Luminar though if there was a completely different name.
- Opened Luminar. It was empty at first but then slowly added the folder structure that was in place before. The thumbnails came in eventually as well but on each thumbnail and on the root folder of the library there was an exclamation mark.
- Clicked on the exclamation mark of the root folder and it asked whether I'd want to "Locate Missing Folder". Confirmed and chose the same root folder again on the new drive.
- The exclamation marks started to disappear and I was able to open up a file in Edit mode, with all the edits intact.
So I can confirm that if your internal/external HD dies or gets swapped out, you can get all your edits back from your backup and continue on a new drive/machine. That was one of my biggest worries, thankfully this works, at least in 3.0.2.
As for editing files outside of Luminar, like metadata, this does work too, as long as Luminar is closed. Do your metadata edits either before or after image edits while Luminar is closed. The next time you open Luminar, it will read in whatever metadata is in the file, so it shows the updated information.
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My current project is to digitize slides I made during a year I worked as a social scientist in Turkey. My workflow is to make three bracketed images about 2 EV apart (-1, +1, +2). The raw images are batched processed with Aurora and the output stored in a sub-folder below the main folder. I edited selected images and put the output into another sub-folder under the raw image folder.
After I got started, I discovered that my cataloging system needed to be modified to be more logical and more useful. Because Luminar 3.x still does not have a workable DAM, I continue to use DigiKam. I used DigiKam to rename the folders (not the files). Luminar found and cataloged the images in the renamed folders, apparently as new images, and all the edit data seems to be missing. I cannot find or figure out a way to have the Luminar catalog update to the new image path. Practically, this means I have to re-edit the photos I had already edited. I do have the exported files, just not the edit history.
It seems to me that this is a rigid system, though I expect that it is also characteristic of other programs--Corel AfterShot creates its own database, as does DigiKam, as does ... you name it.
We all need a way to keep our work as we adopt and adapt to different technologies. I know from experience that computer crashes are real, and that backups are needed (I have daily backups to a NAS).
What bothers me now is that Luminar is not good enough to stand alone, and it will not easily tolerate collaboration with others. Now, I'll return to re-editing my lost work. Not exactly a happy camper. I just like the tent that Luminar provides.
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Hi James. Please contact us via https://skylum.com/support and we will do our best to help you with your lost edits.
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